But in 1872 it had not one but now two rivals. By August that year the Vale of Leven Rugby and Athletic Club had been founded. It looks as if the oval-ball game was about to infiltrate. But, whether before or after the formation of VLRAC, Queen's Park Football Club visited Alexandria to demonstrate to the shinty-men its round-ball game and would do so, it is said, again later in the year, at which point, perhaps even without a rugby match having taken place, VLRAC became VLFAC. The Vale of Leven Football and Athletic Club was born and within five years would become the best football club in Scotland certainly and in the World by results by, as Scottish Cup holders for a now second, consecutive time, in 1878 easily defeating away the best England could offer, its FA Cup winners, The Wanderers. Indeed it all might have happened earlier had not the first football rammie not taken place over one of its star-players, John Ferguson, and whether he, as a runner who had taken prize-money at athletics meets, was a professional or not. It meant The Vale had withdrawn from the first two playings of the Scottish Cup, not able to begin to show what it could do until 1875-6, when it at first time of asking reached the semi-final - to lose by the odd goal in three and away at the first Hampden Park to the home club and its former tutor, Queen's Park.  

But several of its team were and remained noted shinty-players. John McGregor was one. David Lindsay another, Sandy McLintock, a third and it is impossible to believe that there had not been and and continued to be cross-over. In fact, when in 1879-80 The Vale was knocked out of the Scottish Cup in the first-round away by neighbours, Dumbarton, by the odd goal in seven, an own-goal, it promptly returned to the Highland game and won the 1880 Glasgow Camanachd Cup instead. Moreover, it is said that when the Leven players were invited in 1872 to take the field against Queen's Park they had done so in shinty-formation with, at that moment, the Glasgow club unknowingly having a first glimpse but also perhaps first idea of its own future. It would in the first international in late 1872 introduce defence, using a formation, which might also have originated in shinty. By 1880 it too would all over the park be playing the Vale-way, what might in short-hand be described positionally and in terms of movement as the "Shinty-ball" way, as was by then much of the rest of Scottish football, the national side and teams elsewhere in Britain and even abroad, for example Canada, as there shinty's more obviously direct spin-off, ice-hockey, was also taking root.